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Re: Applying Early |
Jun 23, 2010, 4:30 PM |
| #1
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(1) From my experience (personal and secondhand stories), judges who hire off-plan are aware that certain schools do not allow their professors to submit letters of recommendation off-plan. Thus, off-plan judges rely on a list of references. In lieu of a letter of recommendation, they'll call each reference and have a conversation about the candidate. So, unless you've heard otherwise, a list of references should suffice.
(2) "How should students go about learning whether a judge will take early applications?" Talk with your school's clerkship advisor, if your school has one. If you know someone (or have a connection to someone--e.g., same school) who is clerking for the specific judge or in the courthouse of the specific judge. If all else fails, call the judge's chambers and ask directly; if you're polite, the judicial assistant or clerk should provide a quick answer. Finally, don't forget about sites like LCA, which can be invaluable in seeing which judges are starting to move.
These are my opinions based on my own experience, so caveat emptor. Nevertheless, hope this helps!
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– Anonymous (Unregistered)
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Re: Applying Early |
Jun 23, 2010, 9:12 PM |
| #2
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From my experience, start with your clerkship advisor. Beyond that, a combination of checking OSCAR and contacting chambers is the best way to find out about off-plan judges. It seems like most of the hiring have been graduates who aren't on the plan, and the other judges who have hired 3Ls seem to generally have a reputation for doing so (e.g. Kozinski, Reinhardt).
Would have been nice to know about references v. recommendations. A little late for me now though, I suppose.
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– Anonymous (Unregistered)
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Applying early |
Jun 24, 2010, 11:38 AM |
| #3
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Something people need to realize is that, outside of those circuits that hire current students early and are very open about it (e.g., 10th), most of the judges that go early are feeder-types (Reinhardt, Posner, Kozinski, etc.). You need powerhouse faculty or, for those judges that do it this way, your name on a list sent to the judge by the dean to even get an interview (much less the actual clerkship). If you were in the running, you would of by now. Not to be harsh, but if you haven't been approached, you aren't getting one of those clerkships.
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– Anonymous (Unregistered)
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Re: #3 |
Jun 25, 2010, 12:49 PM |
| #4
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#3 is spot-on when it comes to the feeder judges. But I think it's going a bit too far to say that MOST judges who hire early are the feederjudges. There are plenty of nonfeeder circuit judges, if you will, who hire off-plan. These include judges from the 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th, 9th, 10th, and 11th.
Basically, if you think you might want to go off-plan or are targeting a particular judge (that you legitimately have a shot at), you should do your homework by talking with your clerkship advisor, connections, etc. Don't simply assume that if the judge is not a feeder judge he/she is not off-plan.
Other than that, I agree with everything #3 said about the feeder judges.
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– #1 (Unregistered)
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Impacts of the recession |
Jul 9, 2010, 5:27 PM |
| #5
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While clerkships were formerly viewed as jobs for graduating 3Ls, the recession appears to be changing that. The near-collapse of the financial services industry and the stock market crash from the fall of 2008 into the spring of 2009 led to a drastic decrease in the demand for private-sector legal services. This resulted in layoffs of large numbers of first, second and third year associates from corporate law firms. Finding nothing in the private sector, many of those former associates applied for clerkships. Because many of them had been well-qualified academically, and because they had work experience, many judges hired them. Judges, especially those in courts with demanding dockets, now appear to view post-graduation work experience as a highly desirable attribute, if not an absolute requirement, for clerkship applicants. Unlike hiring 3L students, hiring graduates with work experience is not affected by the plan. As a result, many clerkship positions are now being filled a year or more in advance by graduates who already have work experience, or will have some by the time they begin clerking. This means that clerkships have become significantly harder to obtain for 3Ls, even for students on the editorial boards of law reviews at the most highly ranked law schools. This is unfortunate, but is just one more example of the pervasive impacts of the recession on the legal profession, and indeed on society as a whole.
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– Anonymous (Unregistered)
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| #6
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– Daveigh (Unregistered)
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| #7
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– casyernadaa (Unregistered)
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